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Midtown Madness 2 Central > General Discussion > MM2FN Standard - Ammendment Proposal (7/21/05)
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Legoguy
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Post subject: MM2FN Standard - Ammendment Proposal (7/21/05) Reply with quote

As mentioned by me in the MM2 Expansion Pack thread, I'd like to begin a MM2[C] - wide standard for naming car and city files.

The proposed format is this:

[See end of this post]

We've needed a system like this for a long time, much too often cars have conflicting filenames and/or texture references. Creating a standard format will solve the problem.


Current standard definition (
6/12/2003):

TurboGfx MM2FNS Page wrote:
The current format standard goes as follows:

Internal addon core files:

[author]_[shortened title][_*].*

Example
: lego_vwturbo.info or lego_vwturbo_WHL0.dgbangerdata



AR files (final file to be downloaded):


city_[author]_[shortened title].ar - Cities

car_[author]_[shortened title].ar - Cars

gen_[author]_[shortened title].ar - General modifications


Examples:

city_lego_legoisle.ar - City

car_lego_vwturbo.ar - Car

gen_lego_tachmod.ar - General Modification



Adding something else to the AR
: Many people have begun to include custom reflection maps in their cars. Here's a solution to resolve custom reflection conflicts: authors should not put anything in the front of their addon's filename.

The decision of what reflection map to use is soley up to the user of the game. If there is a reflection map for your car, put it in a seperate AR file with the same name as your main file but with this added prefix:
refl_
That will let the user know that there is a custom map that goes along with the similar filename. If the user wants to use that map, they should put a ! in front of the filename, otherwise all custom maps will be loaded after the mm2 one, effectivley disabling them.


If it is something that absolutley needs to be at the top of the list, then put it in a seperate file with a !req_ prefix.


Notes:
Already released cars do not need to be re-released with updated names. Only new cars are highly engouraged to use the format.

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Last edited by Legoguy on 21 Jul 2005 09:10 pm; edited 6 times in total
Post 06 Jun 2003 07:16 pm
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fre_ber
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Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, this is very good. But we have to harmonize it with this thread so that we use the same standard for all MM2 modifications.
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Post 06 Jun 2003 07:24 pm
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CMTegner
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Post subject: Reply with quote

That's acctually a very good idea, I'll back you up on that one Lego. Since my Civic is soon done, I'll use that naming method.

Let the games begin!

Oh, sorry... Wink
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Post 06 Jun 2003 07:30 pm
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Legoguy
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Post subject: Reply with quote

Combining those 2 standards creates this format:

[author]_[shortened title][_*].*

And the AR file would be named like this:

city_[author]_[shortened title].ar - Cities

car_[author]_[shortened title].ar - Cars

gen_[author]_[shortened title].ar - General modifications

Adding something else to the AR:
Many people have begun to include custom reflection maps in their cars. Here's my proposal to resolve custom reflections:

authors should not put anything in the front of their addon's filename.
The decision of what reflection map to use is soley up to the user of the game. If there is a reflection map for your car, put it in a seperate AR file with the same name as your main file but with this added prefix:
refl_
That will let the user know that there is a custom map that goes along with the similar filename. If the user wants to use that map, they should put a ! in front of the filename, otherwise all custom maps will be loaded after the mm2 one, effectivley disabling them.
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"There is no loneliness on this planet. All the dark things are in your mind. This place is colorful and neutral; brutal, nice, caring and destructive -- all at the same time. Start to think a little." -- Pete Namlook; The Dark Side of the Moog X: Astro Know Me Domina, Part I


Last edited by Legoguy on 06 Jun 2003 07:40 pm; edited 2 times in total
Post 06 Jun 2003 07:34 pm
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fre_ber
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Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks good to me.
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Post 06 Jun 2003 07:38 pm
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Legoguy
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Now begins the part where I would like the cooperation of all the car makers at MM2C. I would suggest you update all your releases with the correct filename format, to help you out there is a nifty little program to batch rename files, replacing a string with another one:
http://www.antp.be/software/renamer
It comes in very handy for other things too.
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Post 06 Jun 2003 07:40 pm
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fre_ber
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Post subject: Reply with quote

Not only car makers - the same applies to the city- and other mod makers. Please? Wink
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Post 06 Jun 2003 07:42 pm
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Legoguy
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Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, I need the cooperation of all addon makers Wink
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Post 06 Jun 2003 07:59 pm
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Stereo
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Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe Rippance could help out with this by making a section "Conflict-free confirmed files"? Razz
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Post 06 Jun 2003 08:00 pm
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Legoguy
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Post subject: Reply with quote

No, all he'd have to do is mark it as "Conforms to MM2FN Standards"

I'd like to officially name this standard the MM2FN.
MM2FN Standard = Midtown Madness 2 File Name Standard Wink
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Post 06 Jun 2003 08:06 pm
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Mr_Sparkle
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Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a fine idea, but here's where I think the problems come in:

1.) You're never going to get every single person to adapt to this format; remember that there are some carmakers who do not frequent the forums who still submit files to MM2C.

2.) This has been attempted before; when MM2 car editing was just beginning, HPB_Forever proposed using the "car_" prefix for all add-on vehicles. Some people used it and still do use it (myself included), but there is still a large split between people who use the "car_" prefix, people who still use the MM1 "vp" prefix, and people who use neither prefix.

3.) Not to sound ignorant, but although it might be easy for those of you who only have a small handful of vehicles released, I have released 16 vehicles. Changing these and re-releasing them to adapt to the new file naming system would require a ton of time and effort, time being the resource I severely lack.

I know there are sometimes problems with texture conflicts, but this is something I have only seen perhaps a few times in the several years I have been in the community. Personally, I think that we have lasted long enough using whichever prefixes we prefer without very many problems, so why not let sleeping dogs lie.
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fre_ber
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Post subject: Reply with quote

The more modifications we get, the larger the risk of conflicts will become.
</Yoda>

I understand that renaming all files in old mods might not be practical, but if new mods all use the standard, that doesn't matter - there will be no conflict.

Also, ok, many mod makers might not read these foras, but don't you think that the word will spread if, for example MM2C only accepts mods following the standards?
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Post 06 Jun 2003 08:26 pm
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Legoguy
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I understand all of your arguments Sparkle, but with so many new cars and cities beginning to arise, it would be for the best of the clueless mm2 user to have an organized way of knowing what files are what, not to mention the power-users that find "!" in front of their files extremley annoying unless you absolutley must have it there.
I thought through all of the arguments you gave before even posting the idea, I knew they would be brought up in the thread.

1: Of course not every single person who has MM2 visits MM2C, but the majority do, and even a larger majority of the mm2 car makers visit. If we can get as many people as possible that visit here to follow the standard, other people will see how it's done just by downloading the standardized cars.

2: Yes, I do know that it has been attempted, and I know that people don't follow it. We can't do anything but persuade them with the benefits of using the format to change their ways, and even then some will keep their old ways. That's fine, not every single car should be required to be standardized, just a majority.

3: I see your point here, and I thought about this myself. We can't possibly require people to go back and change their files, and redefine their textures. It's just a voluntary thing, if you want to, and want to make it easier on people when they downlaod your car, you will (not saying that you don't want that if you don't standardize Wink )
I myself am going to standardize all my current cars.


But where this standard comes into play is the new cars and cities. People who are currently working on or are planning a car can adopt the standard with no problem.

How did the W3C standardize HTML and CSS? Exaclty the same way this standards thread is trying to do; and we might not have been here had the W3C not standardized HTML. Think about it; It was undoubtedly easier for the W3C because there were no other formats really gaining attention at the time, but that really has no impact on the argument, they still did the exact same thing as this thread attempts.

As far as MM2C only accepting new addons/mods in the standardized format, that's not a bad idea, the only exception is the addons already in the database. We should only accept new addons with the standard format -- if not at least strictly encourage it -- to help the format become a true standard-all of the best MM2 addon makers preside here at the forums, at least most of them do, and knowing most of them, they probably won't mind making their next addon follow the standards.
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Post 06 Jun 2003 08:33 pm
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Post subject: Reply with quote

I will back you up on this one Lego, putting aside the obvious arguments. I haven't released anything yet, but I have a few things very close to it, so I shall be a part. I think it would be easy to put your name in front of it. Yes I know, already mentioned. But maybe it would be the first 3 letters of the name you wish to go by (unless your name is only 3 letters long), so for example, mine would go something like this:

veg_murc.pkg

or

veg_512.pkg

You can simply add this short prefix to the beginning of each file inside the AR. And, like you said Lego, if you must, put an ! at the beginning, if it is a file that will only work if it's recognized at the top of the list. That's my two cents.
Post 06 Jun 2003 09:42 pm
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Legoguy
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If its something that'll only work at the top of the list, yes, you may put a "!" but if its a reflection you must leave it up to the person who downloads the addon to decide whether or not to use it.
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"There is no loneliness on this planet. All the dark things are in your mind. This place is colorful and neutral; brutal, nice, caring and destructive -- all at the same time. Start to think a little." -- Pete Namlook; The Dark Side of the Moog X: Astro Know Me Domina, Part I


Last edited by Legoguy on 19 Apr 2005 07:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
Post 06 Jun 2003 11:03 pm
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